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3.3

Got suckered like everyone else. Had a Rinnai that had the bulletproof reliability of a Honda engine. It was just a hot water system not furnace. Never stopped working in 6 years of hard labor, but it couldn't supply our high water needs at the time. Old furnace started dropping hot lava embers and carbon monoxide, it had to go.

After some time researching, this great sounding company talking a good game during the whole DIY/going green phase, reeled us in. We ended up signing for the overhyped state of the

art 240 series gas combi unit which failed right before it's 4th birthday. After googling Navien and my model reviews, I think I got a good one lol. Company who did the beautiful installation is conveniently out of business less than 3 years later. 3rd party company [Earthtec Solutions] came out, had my info in system. Some of the installer guys from previous company were with 3rd party company. They seemed to remember my home, install, etc. over the phone ..Cool. They also seemed to know confidently that it was most likely a valve or pump. They say they just happen to have those 2 parts in stock, but normally getting parts is a process, and Navien will only replace defective parts on a tedious case-by-case troubleshooting basis. Plumber MUST verify that you had routine annual maintenance ($375 - $400) on the unit, otherwise you pay for parts. This was NEVER EVER mentioned or even hinted at time of sale, nor after install. I can see why people mention class action lawsuit in unhappy reviews.

The technician:

Plumber arrived an hour late with a young male apprentice, worked for 5 hours as I watched and I asked tons of questions, then had the balls to charge me 7.25 hours labor. Wtf? They claim they had to stop somewhere to get a special blade tool. Grrr. How did they know they'd need that blade before even seeing my problem? Oh yeah 40 yrs experience, and you know your product well...Well if I called in advance on Friday, scheduled an appointment for 7:30am Monday morning, you get here an hour late, why the fvkk would you tell me some chit about having to get a tool?! THEN CHARGE ME 2 hours labor to cover THAT!???

Unprofessional and just plain greedy & disrespectful and just bad business. So your shop is 30min from my house, did you go to Home Depot in the next state over before coming to me? Two frikkin hours and 15 minutes to grab a blade? Wtf!

Ok, be smart. Don't call him out on his shadyness, don't cuss him out and threaten to put hands on him, try not to crap on the product as it clearly bothers him, offer to help, etc. I have to say he was very pleasant, professional demeanor, knowledgeable, etc. During the installation, I kept having mixed thoughts. I read the horrible reviews, and here I was experiencing it in real time dejavu. Too late to do anything now, hopefully it'll be no more than $200?? maybe $350 tops! Peep.

Issues: no heat. Plus hot water is luke warm water for 2 seconds, then cold and stays cold. Like it wants to come on, but shuts off instantly, yet the motor is clearly running loudly and making grinding/garbage disposal/jet engine sounds. Even with the power off! So I unplugged it.

Diagnosis:

It was a faulty pump and 3way valve. Also my condensation drain hose needed replacement as it was copper and corroded to the point of eating thru the pipe and severing it. Same effect as when the blood from Aliens (movie) drips on metal. Whatever is dripping from this unit is very corrosive and acidic. The proper drain tube should be pvc or special plastic. Original installer screwed up!

Time to get bent over: Expect to pay $700 to $800 labor to replace pump and valve. Those parts are like $300 to $400 total (allegedly).

Add $350 to $400 for the regular maintenance/ service required for the warranty.

Add another $25 to $50 for misc items and pieces.

Note: In 4 years I never had any service done (it was never mentioned), as I was told this is in every way "Better than" my old Rinnai. It's state-of-the-art, maintenance free, twice as reliable, more flow, no special vent pipe needed, %40 savings on heating bill, blah blah, blah. Anyway, it's been pretty solid up until last week, although it didn't really have to work too hard under what I call VERY responsible use. Lower temps on unit, set programmable thermostats at 68-70 degrees maximum, use cold water to do laundry, dishes, etc. In a normal American household with a decent sized family around the clock using hot water, I would expect the failure to be much sooner, figure by the 2nd or 3rd year after install.

Extra Service/maintenance:

So at the end, I had them do the $375 "required maintenance" to keep a warranty. It consists of: cleaning the water filter (similar to the filter on a washing machine- just a mesh plastic cylinder) Cleaning the fresh air filter screen (its stainless steel mesh like a mini rice strainer with a plastic handle, and may require light scrubbing with a scotchbrite pad). Doing a radiator flush of sorts. They run some acidic phosphate type chemical through the pipes to clean rust and scale/ deposits/ gunk/lime, etc Minor adjustments, drips, and physical checks here and there, and whatever else they did when I momentarily left them unattended.

Observation:

My unit was very clean internally! Plumber confirmed that. Only the air filter mesh showed signs of any use. No discolored water in the flush, clean water filter, no debris anywhere. In other words, the unit had absolutely NO reason to fail during my time with it. Also the tech who only installs Navien couldn't say exactly what caused failure nor what to do to prevent this going forward. He just stressed continuing the maintenance annually, I think he meant anally.

Assessment:

If Rinnai is a Honda, then Navien is a cheap Chinese scooter (Tao-Tao ATM50). Lots of options and features but garbage long term reliability, poor durability, proprietary parts, cheaper than the proven brands but more powerful. Also they seem to be produced in a limited run, company disappears, new improved model surfaces with no proven history, cycle repeats itself.

Advice:

Dont ever touch Navien until they have 20 years experience in the business, or they get AAA rated, and Consumer Reports can recommend.

Closing:

This is how they do it in the industry. It's borderline scammy imo. No doubt a class action law suit should be initiated. Boilers and furnaces are things you hear about failing as a kid, then you grow up and have your kids, and that same boiler/furnace should be going strong. This Navea is a joke. You will practically pay for a new unit every 2 to 5 years in service costs. Even if the equivalent Rinnai heater costs $1000 more, get the Rinnai..trust me. Even if it flows less gallons per minute.

Location: Springfield, Missouri

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WOW !!!

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